Update (4:00 PM): Tom Benjamin reacts to the no-goal call and to the comparison being made between that play and the missed interference call in Game 1:
On the other hand, last night’s mistake was inexcusable. Kelly did make something up. He did not see Holmstrom interfere with Turco because there was no interference. The referee called something he did not see. We know he did not see it because he called something that did not happen.
Another difference: The goal in Game 1 was the Wings’ third in a game that finished 4-1 Detroit. It was not the game-winner and had little bearing on a game the Wings would have won anyway. Last night’s blown call came on the first goal of the game. Had it been allowed, the face of the game would have been changed. - Matt
Update (12:28 PM): Typo in title corrected. - Matt
Embarrassing. That’s the most polite way to describe Game 4. The waived off goal was easily in the top three worst calls I have ever seen.
If, as I believe, Kelly Sutherland was the center ice official, he had no business making that call when Dan O’Halloran was right there. I absolutely hate it when the center ice official makes a call that directly contradicts the referee who was right there. Am I wrong to remember that the play was initially ruled a goal? If it was, how could it just be overturned by the word of a man fifty feet away from the event?
Because the play did not occur in overtime, we cannot say with certainty that the blown call cost the Wings the win, but there can be no doubt that that goal would have changed the face of the game. Dallas has shown a mental weakness thus far in this series in that they crumble when scored on first. I have little doubt that the same thing would have happened again had the goal not been waived off in a fit of unadulterated idiocy by Sutherland. As it was, the blown call acted as a security blanket for the weak-minded Dallas team and gave them the mental fortitude to play actual hockey for one of the few times in this series.
Marty Turco, for whom I now have zero respect, is mouthing off about how that was a makeup call for the “missed” goaltender interference penalty on Holmstrom in Game 1. If so, I call that BS. This is a professional sports league, not some weak collection of pickup games. There should be no makeup calls. Makeup calls are bush league. In the National Hockey League, teams should be doing the making up, not the officials. It’s bad enough when it’s in the regular season and it’s a bad hooking call to make up for a bad tripping call. It’s a thousand times worse to do it in the Stanley Cup playoffs when the games mean everything.
If I were completely rational about this and didn’t have an irrational love for the game, the team, and the players, I would quit the NHL today. Why would I want to waste my time on a League that cannot ensure the quality of officiating that should be an inherent part of a top-tier professional sports league? Why would I want to waste my time on a League that disallows legitimate scoring? If I was rational about this, I wouldn’t. As it is, however, I’ll foolishly hold to this game, something I love and hate so much at the same time.
Gary Bettman should be embarrassed. He was at the game. I wonder what he thought when he saw that. Does he enjoy leading a League that is a joke to sports fans around the world? Waiving off legitimate goals is an embarrassment to the game. It really is.
It’s days like these that conspiracy theories almost start to make sense. Almost. I’m sure the NHL loves the fact that Game 5 is happening and that NBC will have the opportunity to broadcast it. But I don’t buy the idea that this was a Bettman-ordered result. That’s giving Kelly Sutherland too much credit.
If the goal was waived off an Holmstrom really was in the crease, I would be disappointed, but honest enough to admit the right call was made. But he wasn’t in the crease and the right call was not made.
The League has got to institute some kind of safeguard against that kind of thing. Why on earth is there no replay for that? Why can’t the replay booth look at the goal in the moments immediately following it being waived off (or allowed) and notify the on-ice officials before the puck is dropped? It wouldn’t even have to be a formal review period just so long as the review booth officials have the power to stop on-ice proceedings, a la NFL review booth officials in the final two minutes.
After that call was made, I was so angry I kept wishing Holmstrom would just run Turco over. If he’s going to get called for it, he might as well get his money’s worth. Thankfully, the Wings kept their emotions in check better than I did.
Kudos to the Stars for actually showing up to play last night. It’s good to know you’ve finally realized you’re in the Western Conference Finals. It’s just too bad you can’t have a win not sullied by a monumentally blown call. You outplayed the Wings in most phases of the game. Good for you. It won’t happen again.
Not only did Sutherland look stupid on the blown goal call, he and O’Halloran were oblivious to the Stars’ shenanigans all night. The officiating was terrible. Almost as bad as the waived off goal was the fact that Steve Ott got away with assault in the final seconds of the game. Of course, it was almost a moot point, but it’s the principle of the thing. He was brutalizing Tomas Holmstrom and got away scot free. To call Ott a donkey is an insult to good donkeys everywhere.
Aside from that, how many other times were Red Wings crosschecked or tripped in the process of taking a shot? Or blatantly interfered with? Also, how was Eriksson’s goal not waived off? The guy’s entire body was in the crease. I’m sure Osgood would have loved to have that space to move across, but it was occupied by a Dallas Star. Textbook goaltender interference.
All that said, the Wings had ample opportunity to overcome those difficulties, including the waived off goal. They allowed themselves to be outplayed last night and did not put forth the effort necessary to win. They will have to play better on Saturday and I have no doubt that they will. The Stars have gotten their win, but the Wings will have their series in Game 5.
Marty Turco finally stole a game…….. by whining.
Matt,
Thank you for saying what I have yet been unable to articulate. I was absolutely infuriated last night with everything that went on. I can’t believe I didn’t just turn off the game in the second period.
I love hockey as a game. I think it has tremendous potential to be a team sport as well as a sport that people go and watch whereever they will. Hockey is infinitely more interesting, in my opinion, than baseball, and football, and even basketball since the players went the way of the Dennis Rodman Showboaters.
That said, the NHL isn’t doing hockey any favors… they have sunk to a new low. Bad officiating from other games aside, like you said, this game wasn’t officiated, it was managed. One team was the darling. I have been a hockey fan for almost 15 years. Today I told everyone in my office that if they ever planned to be a hockey fan, don’t get interested in the NHL. That’s how angry I am today.
If the tables were turned and the Red Wings won because Dallas had one legitimate goal waived off, and another goal waived off as well in the third period, and the Wings scored on a very questionable play, and *only won by 2 goals*, I would be feeling pretty low. That would not feel like a win to me. And you know how the talking heads in the media would be bashing the Wings, too.
I hope that the Wings respond positively and beat the tar out of Dallas on the scoreboard at home on Saturday. Thanks Gary. Ass.
Well said, Matt. I’m no Wings fan, but thanks to some circumstances I have one that is living under my roof for the next month or so, and he was pissed beyond words.
I was a little more cool-headed, but as you say, these calls are absolutely disgusting and embarrassing. I think the better team is still set to come out of this series, but I think it would be a lot better if they didn’t make the topic of the day idiot officiating.
Bush league, dude. Hopefully it’s better in G5 and going forward.
Talk about whining. Could you possibly be a bigger homer? I LOVE my Wings but the Stars played like a team facing elimination. In fact i have been surprised all series that their effort has seemed flat thus far. The goal being waved off was a bad call. Make up calls are a bad idea, but lets not get carried away. Quit the NHL? Come on. Just pull your panties out of the twist they are in and celebrate our win on saturday. A bad call or bad calls cannot advance a weaker team. The best team will prevail in spite. Expect that on Saturday.
I think the game in general is too fast for all the decisions to be made by on ice officials. Hence video replay. But they must be too proud too use it.
Did you see Gary Buttman, standing there, at a hockey game in a suit. He made me uncomfortable just looking at him, somebody buy him a pair of jeans please!
@ Penny,
I didn’t say that the bad call would “advance a weaker team”. Don’t misunderstand me. Matter of fact, I think that I said that I hoped that “your Wings” would beat Dallas on the scoreboard. I think that, with the kind of game they played in Game 3 this series, they can take Dallas out of the series, whether we get good officiating, mediocre officiating, or Game 4 officiating.
My point, call it homerism if you want, that the wrong call was made, and I hope that the NHL and the official in question are feeling a whole bunch of shame. And the NHL is showing the beginnings of becoming a joke, like WWF wrestling. It’s not there yet, but another 10-20 years of Gary Bettman (or others like him) might make it simply a marketing exercise, the plaything of uber-business people. It’s not just the Detroit series. I heard last night that 20 different goals have been called back for goalkeeper interference just this year in the playoffs. I’m sure that not all of them were good calls, especially after last night’s show.
The Red Wings are my team. I won’t make that a secret. I like different players on other teams. I love the character that so many in the NHL play with. I love how hard work is rewarded, and I especially love the character in the Red Wings dressing room. But I am *not* a fan of the NHL. If the NHL were run in the upper levels like the Red Wing’s organization is, I think we wouldn’t be having this conversation right now.
I apologize if my “whining” bothers you. But I don’t apologize for my position on this matter.
Penny, you’re right, it’s certainly not the worst thing in the world going on right now that the Wings got screwed (i.e., Iraq, Myanmar, China, etc.), and Detroit certainly can’t let one called-back goal derail them. Still, I think most hockey fans should be rather outraged because the NHL is a product that we pay for, directly or indirectly, and last night the NHL sold us one spoiled lemon of a tilt. The call wasn’t a bad call–bad calls are mistakes made by imperfect people trying to do their best to make a living enforcing the rules of the game, and those are easy to move on from. The Holmstrom “interference” on the other hand was a very clear case of the officiating stepping over its bounds–committing a deliberate error to try to ammend another error that was made *three games* previously, and I’m sorry, but that dog just won’t fly. It’s that the mistake was made deliberately that puts my panties in a twist. The Stars might have won anyhow, they certainly played their best game of the series and were more desperate than Detroit–but now instead of talking about an otherwise great playoff game, we’re talking about yet another thing that is deeply wrong with the NHL right now. The NHL keeps shooting itself in the foot, even here on the eve of the most anticipated Cup Finals since who knows when? But, to try to put it positively, we can think of Saturday as a nice bonus game–Ilitch gets to fill up the Joe one more time before the finals, so I guess that can’t be a bad thing…
Thank you Jason for responding in a more even-keel fashion than I am able to right now.
I don’t get *near* this upset for just any called back goal. I don’t get near this upset when the Wings lose. I didn’t even get near this upset when the Wings lost to the Ducks in the WCF last year, and listened to Ken Kal the whole way through that game.
I get upset when I smell a rat. And that’s why I’m having a hard time getting past last night. And that’s one reason why I am glad I don’t make a living at the sport of hockey.
Can’t disagree about the call on Holmstrom.
It was a poor call to waive off Datsyuk’s goal just because his butt was over the line. Of course, I thought his goal in Game 1 should have been waived off for interference.
Like Babcock said, it was a reputation call. Sometimes he’s going to get away with it and sometimes he’ll get screwed.
“Not only did Sutherland look stupid on the blown goal call, he and O’Halloran were oblivious to the Stars’ shenanigans all night. The officiating was terrible. Almost as bad as the waived off goal was the fact that Steve Ott got away with assault in the final seconds of the game. Of course, it was almost a moot point, but it’s the principle of the thing. He was brutalizing Tomas Holmstrom and got away scot free. To call Ott a donkey is an insult to good donkeys everywhere.”
I saw it as two guys battling for position at the end of the game. I also saw Holmstrom pull Ott down then give him a punch to the face.
“As it was, the blown call acted as a security blanket for the weak-minded Dallas team and gave them the mental fortitude to play actual hockey for one of the few times in this series.”
No doubt the blown call provided a lift.
But if Dallas was as weak-minded a team as you say they were, wouldn’t they have folded their tents after Zetterberg’s goal early in the third? Afterall, the Stars finally grabbed a lead for the first time in the series late in the second and saw all that hard work get canceled out just 72 seconds later.
It could have provided the impetus for just closing up shop in the third. Instead, they came back, killed off a Detroit power play, earned one themselves, and restored that one-goal lead on a Modano one-timer.
Then Marty stood on his head for bit, Morrow made it a 3-1, and then they withstood a late two man advantage that became a three-man advantage when the Red Wings pulled their goaltender. Weak-willed teams certainly don’t win games like that.
“Marty Turco, for whom I now have zero respect, is mouthing off about how that was a makeup call for the “missed” goaltender interference penalty on Holmstrom in Game 1. If so, I call that BS.”
Turco’s not endorsing the idea that he’s in favor of makeup calls. Somebody asked him a question of whether or not he thought it might be a makeup call and he suggested it might have been.
Nothing more, nothing less.
I don’t like the idea of makeup calls myself. But to go back to what I initially said, i think it was more due to Holmstrom’s reputation.
Matt,
Excellent post, you said a lot of my thoughts, much better than I could ever say them. I was frustrated by the officiating and have been all playoffs, not just for the Wings but in all the series. Credit to the Stars for finally showing up but the amount of hooking, holding, holding the stick, and interference. How does Pavel’s goal get waived off but not Ericsson’s? There is no consistency with the officiating and that is one of the the things that really frustrates me. Even my friends who are Avs fans said it was a joke. But again, Dallas had a lot to do with why the Wings did not win the game. Wings got pinned in their own zone way too many times.
“Marty Turco, for whom I now have zero respect, is mouthing off about how that was a makeup call for the “missed” goaltender interference penalty on Holmstrom in Game 1. If so, I call that BS. This is a professional sports league, not some weak collection of pickup games.”
I second Gravypan on this. It’s quite a jump to take a quote like Marty’s and conclude that you have zero respect for him. I don’t think Marty said anything wrong…
“If I were completely rational about this and didn’t have an irrational love for the game, the team, and the players, I would quit the NHL today. Why would I want to waste my time on a League that cannot ensure the quality of officiating that should be an inherent part of a top-tier professional sports league? Why would I want to waste my time on a League that disallows legitimate scoring? If I was rational about this, I wouldn’t.”
Quite an over-reaction. You’re freakin’ up 3-1 in the series. Relax. The Pens didn’t get the reviewed goal they deserved in Game 2 versus the Flyers, but I wasn’t hissing and moaning over it. I expected the refs to give the Flyers an edge if they could to keep the series close. And I expect the same tonight. And I’m not talking about “quiting the NHL”…you sound like a grumpy Tom Benjamin during the lockout, saying he wouldn’t be a fan of the NHL anymore (and yet he still posts…)
“Thankfully, the Wings kept their emotions in check better than I did.”
I agree with that!
Brian…
“Quite an over-reaction. You’re freakin’ up 3-1 in the series. Relax. The Pens didn’t get the reviewed goal they deserved in Game 2 versus the Flyers, but I wasn’t hissing and moaning over it.”
At least it was reviewed. This was a call because everybody complains about Homer when he does his work. Goalies and DMen alike don’t like him and complain about him. He is so good at deflecting pucks and staying out of the crease, but sometimes he looses footing and ends up in the blue (Game 1). This call came because of the negative reputation that Homer has, and doesn’t deserve. That’s what’s agrivating. A Terrible Call based on an Undersiving reputation.
Oh, and about Matt needing to calm down? F That. Heaven forbid that a Passionate Wings Fan shares his opinions with other passionate wings fans about our team.
I’m sure you feel just as strong about the Cowboys as we do about our wings.
Finally:
“It’s quite a jump to take a quote like Marty’s and conclude that you have zero respect for him. I don’t think Marty said anything wrong…”
That’s just the nail in the coffin. The Slashes on Homer, the tripping on Filps, and the rest of his blatent (and mostly uncalled) penalties are what took the respect I had for Turco away.
I live and work in Texas though, so I’ll let the scoreboard do the talking as soon as the series is over. Hopefully the state picks up on Hockey a little more with the Stars recent success.
Nice rant, Matt. I missed the game due to work, so I guess I was fortunate I didn’t have to go through the stages of rage and disbelief.
” I don’t think Marty said anything wrong…”
Tuco didn’t say anything wrong? WRONG. He did. By agreeing with the call and claiming that he was not given a fair chance to make the save in the post-game interview. Too embarassed to admit you were beaten cleanly, Marty? Grow a ****ing pair and admit that it was a bad call. I’ve also lost quite a bit of respect for Tuco during this series.
I’ve had the same feelings about the NHL as a league for a while now. And it’s not an overreaction just because my favourite team happens to be up 3 games to 1 in the WCF, as Brian claims. To be content and satisfied just because of that would be to be blind and ignorant of the situation in the league. There is too much wrong with the NHL right now and Bettman does nothing to solve those problems. But like Matt, I love the game too much to give it up.
“I’m sure you feel just as strong about the Cowboys as we do about our wings.”
So anyone who doesn’t join in with the over-reacting is automatically a Dallas fan? I’m actually from MI and a Wings fan for 10+ yrs.
There’s a difference between being a passionate fan and throwing a ridiculous fit.
I lost a lot of respect for Turco, when after the Game 2 scrum and his Game 2 loss of composure, had the audacity to say this about the Red Wings (not their fans, but the players themselves):
“We don’t think much of them on a personal, character level. We think that’s to our advantage.”
My respect for Turco (and I wasn’t one to believe the pundits that talked about his record against the Wings, but rather said “we’ll see how the series plays out and then decide that”) has gone steadily down this series. I feel like Matt does about Turco now… after hearing his apologetic of not feeling like he was free to make the save on the called back goal. Homer never touched him. He was free to move, but his view was obstructed. Of course, that’s Homer’s job, and that’s not a penalty by the book. That was the reason that Turco gave for thinking the call was a fair one. I would have had much more respect for Turco if he would have said, “I was fortunate that the referee gave me the benefit of the doubt right there. I don’t know whether the call was a good one or a bad one, but it was the call they made today.”
Instead, Turco had to add his reasoning. There is no reasoning concerning the call. There’s no explaining it objectively. That, I think, is what makes so many hockey fans upset today. Some are more okay with the ambiguity than others, and that’s okay. But I think the league ought to also listen to those who have a bone to pick with them. It just might make the NHL a better all around organization.
The tough thing about all this is that it makes all the conspiracy ideas seem legitimate, just a little bit. I don’t go along with that because to pull off a solid conspiracy you require the participants to have competence, and the officiating isn’t anything close to that. I have a nagging feeling that despite all my logic, the league “wants” the Penguins to win the Cup because they don’t know how to market anyone who isn’t named Sidney Crosby, and they have spent his entire young career positioning him as some kind of league saviour, instead of one of many excellent young players.
I know it makes no sense, but the idea just keeps nagging at me.
And I don’t want to invest time and emotion in a sport that I wonder might be fixed. I don’t like professional wrestling.
I most of all want to be able to explain to someone else exactly what a penalty is and why one was called on a play, and I can’t do that anymore.
Once again. All this “the sky is falling” talk about the league is goofy. Its not any different than it has been for years and years on end. Bad calls will be made, human error will always be a factor (Which brings up the debate for instant replay) I do not understand the notion that the league has somehow fallen into the gutter. This league bashing is all a product of a knee jerk reaction. Remember…I am saying this as a HUGE Wings fan. Its one bad call, of which more will follow. If that goal had occured in overtime then it changes things quite a bit. The Stars won that game fair and square despite the bad call. AGAIN chill out, put away your ropes, torches and pitchforks and simply wait for Satuday to celebrate. In my mind if find it a fair assessment to label this blog story a reactionary piece. If you honestly think the NHL is turning into the WWF then I would ask how and why you have arrived at this lowly opinion of the league? The salary cap? Poor offciating? The rule changes? I cant for the life of me think of ONE thing that is drastic enough to compare the NHL to a bunch of roidhead hicks jumping on one another in the WWF. Go wings!
I have to defend Matt, here. You wanna call him a homer, fine. Do that. I have to disagree. He is usually quite objective and does his best to remain so. A lot of his anger here is as a hockey fan, not a Red Wings fan. Sure, the Detroit fan in him added a lot of anger. But you don’t have to be a Detroit fan to know that was a bad call. You do, however, have to be a Dallas fan to even try to argue that it wasn’t.
As far as losing respect for Turco, this comment was just the icing on the cake. I used to love Turco. He’s a Michigan boy, and he seemed so genuine and down to earth. Plus, he was really good and just didn’t get credit for it. I almost felt bad for him when he couldn’t ever find a way to beat the Red Wings. All that has been flushed down the crapper. From game one on, he’s been whining to the media about everything (a la Vokoun ca. 2006) and at the same time boasting about his team, after every loss. He’s been so arrogant, and he has no right to be at this point.
Then there’s the fact that he makes comments about how the Wings have no class, all while he’s hacking and slashing at anyone who comes near him (a la Roloson ca. pick a day).
Brian, I take issue with the way you criticize any Wings fan that dares show emotion after a bad call or a tough game. Just because someone doesn’t react the exact same way you do doesn’t make them wrong. You talk about how you didn’t freak out about the Pens no-goal as if that somehow makes you better. I didn’t realize you were the standard by which all emotion should be measured. Would you mind sending me an email next time I’m allowed to be frustrated or angry?
I don’t believe that the Stars and the Wings translate to the professional wrestlers. Each NHL team is trying the very best they can and realize that they have no recourse to what the referees have to say. Their word is law; every player’s part is to live with it. So it is with the players, so it is with the fans who watch.
I do agree with you, Penny, in that human error can and will be a factor in hockey, as it is a very fast sport and the refs generally are doing the best that they can. Certain players have been singled out by various teams (see Holmstrom, Ryan Smith, Chris Pronger as a short but characteristic list) and the NHL has put refs on point to watch out for shenanigans.
My question is, why is it that calls are made on certain players not on the basis of something they just did but on the basis of their reputation? When that happens, calls become made up and not based on objectivity. The salary cap and league parity doesn’t make a difference in this. Even poor officiating doesn’t make a difference if it goes both ways. If we say that the NHL Rule Book is nothing but an unheeded bunch of ideals that we can’t adhere to, nothing but some nice suggestions to better enjoy the great sport of hockey, fine and good. In that case, let’s fire the refs and go to the grand ol’ colosseum to watch the hockey match.
But singling certain players out on the basis of reputation is not acceptable. That is why I say the NHL is becoming WWF like. Again, it is to that level yet, but Wings fans have seen enough “phantom calls” against them that I am starting to wonder if Mr. Bettman isn’t trying to get his “parity” in artificial manners.
All I’m arguing for is upholding an objective officiating standard. Something like Baroque said– if my wife says, “Why were they alloed to do that”, or “why was this a penalty” I should like to be able to give her an answer. She’s from the South and she’s seriously wondering right now why she should like the NHL with all the deception going on.
Sorry for the length of my posts… guess I just needed to sound off my frustrations. I do thank you Penny, Jason, and Brian for being “the other side of the coin” that causes me to think through my position to be able to state it as cogently as possible.
Umm… “Again, it is” not “to that level yet”… of the WWF… yet… oops
“Brian, I take issue with the way you criticize any Wings fan that dares show emotion after a bad call or a tough game. Just because someone doesn’t react the exact same way you do doesn’t make them wrong. You talk about how you didn’t freak out about the Pens no-goal as if that somehow makes you better. I didn’t realize you were the standard by which all emotion should be measured. Would you mind sending me an email next time I’m allowed to be frustrated or angry?”
I don’t take issue with “any Wings fan that dares show emotion after a bad call or a tough game.” I was specifically reacting to what Matt said on his blog, and I thought this blog was open to comments. So I don’t quite understand why you joke that I should send you an email next time you’re allowed to be frustrated or angry. None of my comments were directed at you in the first place…
If you post something like that, you’ve gotta expect some mixed reactions…
Brian,
Quite an over-reaction. Relax. I also read Megan’s comment, but I wasn’t hissing and moaning over it. And the way that I react to things is clearly the way that everyone else should too.